Strategic Rebranding for Small Business: Go Beyond the Logo and Grow | Jim Heininger

What is a brand—and why do so many business owners get it wrong?

In this powerful episode of Small Business Pivots, host Michael D. Morrison sits down with Jim Heininger, Principal at Rebranding Experts, to unpack the true meaning of branding and why updating a logo is not the same as rebranding. From iconic transformations like Victoria’s Secret, Abercrombie & Fitch, and Meta (formerly Facebook), Jim breaks down how strategic rebranding fuels long-term business growth.

You’ll discover:

• Why branding is about customer experience, not just visuals
• The 3 types of brand change: refresh, reposition, and complete rebrand
• Jim’s proven 4-step rebranding process used by successful companies
• Why internal alignment is often harder than external updates
• How small businesses have unique advantages in the rebranding process
• Why naming your business after yourself might hurt your exit strategy
• How to use customer research to guide branding decisions—not opinions

Whether you're a small business owner preparing for growth or an entrepreneur building from scratch, this episode is packed with branding insights that could reshape your business.

🎧 Whether your business is stuck or just ready for more growth, this conversation will challenge and inspire you to think differently about your brand.

Jim Heininger: Rebranding Experts, Founder & Principal

Website: https://www.rebrandingexperts.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimheininger/

Rebranding Guidance: https://www.rebrandingexperts.com/rebranding-expertise

Blog: https://www.rebrandingexperts.com/blog

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Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction to Branding Experts
• 4:40 What Branding Actually Means
• 8:10 Refreshes, Repositioning, and Rebranding
• 14:40 Four-Step Comprehensive Rebranding Process
• 21:20 DIY Brand Assessment Strategies
• 31:20 Rebranding Success Metrics and Timeline
• 36:00 Small Business Rebranding Advantages
• 42:24 Final Advice and Closing

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

All right, welcome to another Small Business Pivots. Today we have another special guest from around the world and I know only the business owner can introduce themselves and their company like they can. So I'm going to let you introduce yourself. Tell us a little bit about you and your company.

Speaker 2: 0:27

Branding Experts, which is a very specialized agency that focuses on helping organizations or businesses that need to go through a brand transformation from a beginning to end kind of process to be able to achieve the phenomenal outcomes that rebranding can help bring an organization Wow.

Speaker 1: 0:41

That's. I know a lot of businesses could use that, because I know, just driving down the street from time to time I'll see a vehicle and I'm going.

Speaker 1: 0:52

Okay, I don't even know what you do Like that was a waste of a car wrap because you just put your name and it doesn't even make sense. So, yeah, this is this will be good. So, listeners, buckle up. We're going to introduce the show real quick and we'll be right back. Welcome to Small Business Pivots, a podcast produced for small business owners. I'm your host, michael Morrison, founder and CEO of BOSS, where we make business ownership simplified for success. Our business is helping yours grow. Boss offers business loans with business coaching support. Apply in minutes and get approved and funded in as little as 24 to 48 hours. At businessownershipsimplifiedcom. Jim, I know a lot of our small business owners have gone through trials and tribulations from time to time in their life. I know most of our listeners know by now that I was an introvert, had to overcome that, anything like that that you went through, because I know a lot of business owners learn from other business owners and how you maybe overcame it.

Speaker 2: 1:56

Yeah, I think you know it's the lesson of perseverance. So you know as long a career as I've had, there are ups and downs. Perseverance so you know as long a career as I've had there are. There are ups and downs. There are times when perhaps I was in an organization, working with an organization, where you said this just isn't right, this just isn't working out right, and the kind of strength to be able to say that and say I think we need to take a time out. It's better for both of us, you know to to move on in different directions. So that's probably the that's probably the thing that several times in my career have had the opportunity to experience.

Speaker 1: 2:30

Wow, yeah, there are a lot of people stuck and I know even some of our listeners are not quite business owners yet. They're what I call entrepreneur wannabes. You know they've been thinking about this for years and they're just stuck. So perseverance and being able to move on and get uncomfortable is a big thing. Anything that maybe helped you kind of overcome that and pull the trigger.

Speaker 2: 2:58

You know it really comes down to that confidence in your core, you know, and believing in yourself. And you know if something doesn't feel right for you, then there's probably it's your guts telling you something. Listen to it. So I think it's you know, it's that ability to to you know. You all know what it feels like when things are working well. So when something's not working well, then it feels different and really kind of diving in, questioning yourself, asking all the things, getting to the heart of it and then being able to communicate that to whoever your business partner is, your client, your customer, and be able to say you know, this is how I feel, how are you feeling? And usually it's a mutual kind of agreement then that let's move forward in different directions kind of agreement then that let's move forward in different directions.

Speaker 1: 3:50

Wow, that's, that's powerful and very helpful. You mentioned something communicate and I know with branding that's really what it is is communicating who you are, what you do, that all kinds of good stuff and the vehicles I was kind of mentioning earlier literally have the faces of the owner on the trucks. I've seen these trucks around so they probably have maybe a dozen of the box trucks. I know who the owners are because they're very clear on the side of the vehicle with the company name, but I can't find what they do. So communication is big in the branding world, so we're going to help a lot of people. So, with you being the expert in this, is there a particular place you want to start? Do you want to start from start to end, or are there places you where do you want to go with this to help?

Speaker 2: 4:36

Well, and I think let's let's just turn out was what is branding, and you know what does it mean? Because if you're going to rebrand, that means you're going to start anew, you're going to build a new brand. So what is that brand? In the very beginning, and I always like to encourage people to think of it's not your name, it's not your logo. The brand is the total set of experiences that a customer has with your organization. So it could be a name. That's good or not. It could be the trucks they see rolling down the street with your image on them, and so forth. It could be when you hire them. What's the experience like? How do you relate to the customer? When the customer has a problem, how is it dealt with? All those things feed into that bigger picture of what your brand is. All those things feed into that bigger picture of what your brand is, and I always encourage people to remember.

Speaker 2: 5:27

You try to control the brand for your company. You try to position it the way you want it to and communicate it the way you want it to. At the end of the day, the brand sits in the customer's mind and that's where it really. You know how you see that it's all those experiences, everything rolled in together and do they have a favorable impression of your brand or a negative one? So are they going to choose to do business with you again in the future, or are they going to choose to go to a competitor? So keep that in mind when you're thinking about branding, because branding is all about differentiating. It's all about making sure that people understand what is unique about you, about your company, about the service that you offer, and how it's better or a better match than what your competitors are offering. So brand sits in the mind and branding is about differentiation, so that you can really make sure to embed it in everything that you do. Differentiation so that you can really make sure to embed it in everything that you do. So that's kind of the starting point.

Speaker 2: 6:31

So then, if you think of rebranding, which is what we specialize in, that's when you realize the brand I have is not doing as good a job for me as it should. It's not working hard enough. It's perhaps anchoring me to perceptions of my business that I don't want people thinking about anymore. Maybe you've grown beyond the original service that you offered, or your products are available in new outlets or new services that they were in the past. Or maybe you've grown geographically and so you've got a brand that's very centric to a geographic locale where you started. But now that's kind of an anchor, it's weighing you down and you want to look at the option of rebranding, which would mean standing up an entirely new brand for the organization. That is much more forward-facing, that totally encompasses all the work that you do now and maybe what you may add to your services in the future as well. Maybe it defines a bigger customer group than you originally had and so it kind of untethers you from the past and allows you to move forward aggressively in the future.

Speaker 1: 7:41

So I hear a lot of people say they're rebranding, but from what you're saying, they're not really rebranding because they got a new logo. They say I'm getting my logo redesigned and that's not what you're talking about, is it?

Speaker 2: 7:55

No, no, let me break out kind of three levels of the way we think about it, because these are all very viable strategies that you can pursue. And then rebranding will be the last example, which is the more comprehensive one, because these are all very viable strategies that you can pursue. And then rebranding will be the last example, which is the more comprehensive one. So organizations all the time will refresh their brand and a brand refresh is really more of a visual makeover of your brand to make it look fresher, more modern, attract some news and excitement to your brand. So that might mean changing your logo, updating your logo. It might mean a new website that's got a new color palette and maybe some new messaging, but it's really more visually oriented to bring a new level of excitement to your brand. We see those all the time. Sports teams constantly are changing kind of their merchandise, you know, at the start of a new season to make it look more exciting and to sell a lot more of the new stuff than they did in the past. So we see brand refreshes all the time. The next step up from that is when you would reposition your brand and that would be where you recognize that the way you're being perceived is too limiting and it doesn't reflect fully the direction that you're wanting to go in terms of the products that you're offering, the services that you're offering. So you would define a new customer audience, you would kind of update your brand promise to be more reflective and more inclusive of the new markets you're going to the new geographic areas that maybe you're wanting to expand into. We see brand repositionings all the time in the retail marketplace. So some very visible ones that everybody probably has seen some evidence of is Victoria's Secret. So three or four years ago they said, okay, everybody's perceiving us as being the models on the runway shows and so forth, and that wasn't very inclusive of a whole huge segment of women who were of different body shapes and sizes that weren't buying their products in the past because they were perceived as being that perfect runway model kind of look. So they changed the sizings, they changed the styles of some of their products and so forth to be more inclusive and they started to use other spokespeople that were representative of that inclusivity. Even Megan Rapone, the soccer star you know who's, you know lesbian who is not is trying to impress her man, kind of in what lingerie she's wearing. It was a whole way to open up a new marketplace by repositioning themselves that way. Now it's still kind of in play and it's still working three or four years later and they're still tinkering with that brand repositioning because some ways it hasn't worked, some ways that they're still trying to fix it, so to speak.

Speaker 2: 10:47

Another retail brand repositioning was Abercrombie Fitch. Once again, they used all those sexy models of young teenagers or the boys with their shirts off, ripped abs, all that kind of stuff, and a lot of people weren't buying their products because they said that's not me, I don't see myself in that brand. So they changed the products, they changed the marketing and were able to be more inclusive and bring in new customers that they previously weren't able to capture. Again, both of those examples are all about growth. It's all about how are we going to strategically grow our brand and our business.

Speaker 2: 11:26

Repositioning was the answer there. Then, on top of that, you have rebranding, which is when you're standing up an entirely new brand. Re, you know, is the prefix, means to start anew. So you're not tinkering with what you have as much as what. You are recreating an entirely new brand, and this is where you would change the name of your organization as well, too, to better portray to your customers what you do for them, what is the outcome of having an experience with your brand. And then you would also add to that the repositioning and the refreshing, so it's the total package much more comprehensive kind of effort.

Speaker 2: 12:07

And you don't see this as often, because it's a heavier lift and a heavier investment for a business to do. And you have to do it right, because you have to make sure that it's built upon your past and the equities of your current brand but define yourself in a new way that customers are going to say I love it and new customers are going to say I want to be a part of that. So when we look at rebranding, some of the examples that we see a lot oftentimes they come from mergers or acquisitions, where you've got two companies that are coming together and you're having to make some brand decisions, and sometimes you say we're going to go with a bigger brand, the more well-known brand, or sometimes people say we're going to create an entirely new brand that encompasses both companies that have come as part of this merger, this acquisition. The one that people probably identify with most in recent years is the introduction of Meta as being the parent company, first thing that I thought of.

Speaker 2: 13:07

Yeah of Facebook. So if you look at that situation, facebook was clearly defined as a social media platform and it was carrying a lot of baggage. This is back in the days when people were criticizing Facebook a lot, that it was exposing young people to things they shouldn't be seeing. It had some ulterior motives that people didn't like and they strategically wanted to grow their business into that whole kind of virtual reality space and said this is more than Facebook, this is a whole new business venture that we're wanting to introduce and we want to own it from the beginning. So we want to coin a term, the metaverse which they could own, and then a brand name which put them out in front of anybody else that was in this market. So they introduced meta as their corporate brand name, so not replacing Facebook, but to be the bigger brand name so that they could then more easily progress their virtual reality business lines. And it left behind Facebook and the baggage that it was carrying and it didn't taint meta. Then they kind of cleared a nice clean space for them to be able to go into that new meta universe and their products there, for them to be able to go into that new meta universe and their products there Now.

Speaker 2: 14:30

Is it being successful? Is always a question people are going to talk about. You know it left behind Facebook to do its own business. How successful they've been in the virtual reality thing a lot of different analysts with different opinions on it, but a clear example on how, if you are stuck or you're not, if you have a brand that doesn't necessarily answer what you're wanting to do in terms of your strategic growth, then a rebrand might be the answer to enable you to do that.

Speaker 1: 14:57

You talked about a comprehensive approach to rebranding, to rebranding, and we've worked as a business coach, we've worked alongside with some businesses that rebranded, and they were completely different experiences, you know, cause I guess everyone kind of has their own point of view of how it should be done. But from your lens, how long does that comprehensive approach look like? Like what do you do? For instance, one of our clients they did a deep dive into everything market space, everything and the other one, not quite so much. So on your opinion, kind of, what does that look like? So a company knows what to expect when you say comprehensive.

Speaker 2: 15:39

Yeah, and we, you know. So we've got a four-step process that we, that we follow that big or small, you know, or how aggressive they want. Four-step process that we follow that big or small, you know, or how aggressive they want to get into the effort. There's still pieces of it that you need to do, and the first step of that is really it's assessing your current brand. So what is your current business? What does that brand stand for? How do your customers perceive it? What attributes do they give to the brand, and so forth? So that you know where you're starting from, do they give to the brand, and so forth? So that you know where you're starting from. And oftentimes companies will do a great deal of research to determine how much flexibility customers will give them to change the brand or whether they need to rebrand. So can we reposition it or do we need to rebrand to be able to achieve our business objectives here? The second step, then, and so that's where you know some companies will do a lot of research to have a very clear understanding of that. Others will say you know what, I got a gut feel for what it's like and I might not have the resources to do all that research, I think I know where we need to go and it's based upon anecdotal conversations with customers and so forth. So where we need to go and it's based upon anecdotal conversations with customers and so forth, so let's move forward.

Speaker 2: 16:48

That second step, then, is defining the new brand. So it's saying what equities do we want to pull forward? What are the things that people very proudly say about our brand that need to continue? But then how do we define the new one? What are our business interests? Where do we want to go? What new promise do we want to offer customers? What does that strategic plan say about what our growth planks are going to be in terms of introducing a new product or a new service or growing into new geographic markets? And then defining that new brand, and so that starts with that promise, and what is our unique value proposition going to be toward our customers? And then, from that, you create a name that defines the new brand and illustrates what you're wanting to achieve.

Speaker 2: 17:33

Then it's the new logo, the visual identity, the customer experience. How is that going to change as a part of this rebranding? What are we going to ask our employees to do that they haven't done in the past. And then what's that employee experience going to be? So you kind of stand up that whole new brand, you know, as in step two.

Speaker 2: 17:52

Step three is all the work that goes on behind the scenes to align everything within your organization before you go public, before you tell anybody, um. So that's. That's oftentimes training of employees, it's setting up new systems to be able to create a different customer experience, it's updating the website and having all the new materials produced that are going to show your new brand, your new marketing for when you go to launch. That's all in that alignment stage. And then the fourth step and final step is going to market, launching it out internally, first to make sure that your customers or your employees are all on board, and then introducing it to your customers. And then what is the next year going to look like in terms of how you're going to market that new brand to your customers?

Speaker 2: 18:42

Sometimes, you know, I would say on average, this is about an 18 month experience, um. We have a lot of clients that are trying to condense it down to nine months, um, and which is a tight turnaround, but it can be done because everybody's impatient these days and they want to realize the value of the rebranding as quickly as possible. So you know, dependent upon how much you invest in time and energy up front is really a big determinant in terms of how long it takes for the whole process.

Speaker 1: 19:15

If done well, a rebrand what would you say the return on investment looks like for a company?

Speaker 2: 19:23

So a lot of the research that's been done among you know business executives that have rebranded their organizations you know it's 80 plus percent say you know there was a return on the value that were perceived differently in the marketplace, which allows us to do business in a different way and to grow.

Speaker 2: 19:42

It's all about growth and employees that are engaged in the new brand and believe that there's something different about the organization. And you put the three of those together and that's dynamite. I mean, that's a jetpack for your organization and how you can really ignite growth behind it in a way that doing the same thing over and over again is not going to achieve. So if it's an individual who says I think I'm stuck, my business isn't moving the way I want to, one of your considerations should be what role does my brand play in that? And if I'm going to make some changes to my organization, does changing the brand too and rolling it all under a rebranding initiative achieve the kind of results that I'm wanting to get toward? And you should have very clear metrics as to what you're going to measure against in terms of pre and post rebranding, so that you can truly say the dollars contributed to that, that the effort was worth it.

Speaker 1: 20:48

You're listening to Small Business Pivots. This podcast is produced by my company, boss. Our business is helping yours grow. Boss offers business loans with business coaching support. Apply in minutes and get approved and funded in as little as 24 to 48 hours at businessownershipsimplifiedcom. If you're enjoying this podcast, don't forget to hit the subscribe button and share it as well. Now let's get back to our special guest. I know a lot of listeners may not be in the position to afford or invest in a true rebrand, so what are some things they can be doing to get to that point? In other words, how can they improve their brand, kind of like DIY, do-it-yourself until they can afford it? What are some best practices that most businesses should at least follow on their brand that they currently have?

Speaker 2: 21:46

Well, and I think you know you always want to be on top of what measuring and have keen line of sight into whether the brand is working as hard as it should for you. And that's conversations that you're having with clients, with customers where you see how you're perceived in the marketplace by the people that are doing business with you. And then the people that aren't doing business with you, and why. You know why are, why are they choosing a competitor you know over you and and that can be done anecdotally, that can be you know you equip your, your, your sales team to ask the right questions, to be able to understand those, those kinds of dynamics, and you bring it back together and you know and collectively look at it and study. You know, is what is our brand to people out there? It's not, you know. We know what we're trying to convey, but what are they perceiving of our brand? How are they processing our brand? And is it something we need to tinker with?

Speaker 2: 22:51

And that tinkering, then, can be a brand refresh.

Speaker 2: 22:54

It can be just, you know, it could be a new logo, a new tagline. You know an update of your website that reflects what you've learned in terms of trying to make sure that people are understanding what you want them to. So you know there could be a gap between how you're perceived and what you're wanting to be perceived as, and what can you do to get closer to that? Perceived as, that's all should be normal course of business, you know, for any organization, because you're gonna be working your tail off and think you're doing all the right things and if you, only to find out that your brand and the way you're perceived out in the marketplace is not what you wanted and that's why you're banging your head against the wall, because you think you're here and in reality people view you down here and you got to close that gap, you know. So that's a lot of the DIY work that you should kind of be doing on an ongoing basis before you decide that you need a bigger change, like a repositioning or even something as aggressive as a rebrand.

Speaker 1: 24:01

I know some of the frustration for business owners are going from agency to agency and getting two completely different views. What does a business owner do in those situations? Because I've been with some business owners and they feel like, well, that's just subjective, that's just their opinion. What makes your process different to where it's not an opinion, it's not subjective, it's. Here's some facts.

Speaker 2: 24:27

Yeah. So that's a great question. And and I, you know, I think you know realize that when you, if you have a sore back and you go to a surgeon for you know there's, you know, saying I have a sore back, what are the things that we can do? Well, their solution is surgery, you know. So. So, if you go to a firm that you know, you know, and you say, you know I'm having, you know, trouble with my brand, that's not keeping up, well, their, their solution is going to be let's do it. Oh, you got to do this, you got to go do that. At the end of the day, it's the research, it's the perceptions that tell you what it is that you need to do and what you're allowed to do in your customers' minds. And so I'll use it as an example. We will do, in any exercise that we go through, whether we do a lot of, you know, detailed research or not, we will always say give us a list of 10 of your customers. We want to talk to them one-on-one and and explore. You know, what do they think of your brand today, what do they think of your reputation and what do they think are the areas that you're allowed to grow into and why, and I'll never forget this One client we did.

Speaker 2: 25:40

It was based out of Boston, they were in the construction industry, but what they did is provided the window treatments and acoustical panels and some of those kinds of products for new buildings that were being constructed and they were wanting to get out of the place of being an order taker. For, you know, just send me 10 new blinds to somebody that would come in and evaluate and say, okay, the way you built this building, you got 18 hours of sunshine coming in here and your employees are going to be cooking because they're going to be in direct sunlight all day long. So you need blinds that are going to, you know, have this kind of you know shading and they, if they're on automatic, they're going to come down when the sun comes up. You know there are all sorts of solutions. So much more of a consultative kind of provider to those building construction companies than just ordering, you know, fulfilling an order for 10 blinds.

Speaker 2: 26:39

And so when we talked to their customers and said you know how do they compare against other people that you might order 10 blinds for, they said you know, they've got a showroom that I can go in and see these things. They've got people who are, you know, experts in engineering and can have a conversation with me about this and help me make the right decisions. And so he went back to the client and said you have a wide open door here. You have already earned the place in customers' minds to be more of a consultant to them. You're already kind of doing it.

Speaker 2: 27:15

Now you need to say it more and you need to show the proof of what that outcome will be so that those clients and other ones in the future can see the true value in it. So only by having those kinds of conversations did we say let's go, this is going to work, you know it's going to be terrific and and and then design the new brand that delivered on that kind of promise. So it wasn't like creating a promise that was very real, blue sky. It was a promise that customers already knew they could deliver upon because of the work that they had done with them in the past. That's the goal of being in understanding what the customer thinks before you get too far into this process.

Speaker 1: 27:57

That's a great answer because I think that answers a lot of questions. And if our listeners didn't pick up on this, is this fair to say? If someone just takes your brand and runs with it, that's probably a red flag. That's why it's subjective. But if they do research first, communicate with your clients and your perceived perception in the public, that could be. That's factual right. Is that kind of what you're saying?

Speaker 2: 28:25

And, and you know. Talk to the sales team, because the sales team is they're, they're on the front line of working with um, with with customers, and you know, and, and they're. You know they're the ones that are prospecting and calling that. You know cold calling somebody. You know. What are you hearing about, you know, um, uh, how people perceive the company and their willingness to do work with us.

Speaker 2: 28:47

Talk to the client service people to say you know what are the challenges you run into and do your customers feel that you were resolving those challenges in a timely manner? And what are they asking you to do that you can't do, you know, because that's in a sense they're saying I would be willing to let you do this if you had the product, if you had the service for it. So what are they asking you for? But you're saying I'm sorry, we can't do that. So there's a lot of that kind of insight that you can gain in a very qualitative kind of standpoint to really inform what your brand is, what elasticity does it have and what kind of solution. You need Somebody that comes flying in from the outside and throws pretty new logos and colors up and says you know, this is what you need to do. Without that kind of grounding and insight, they're going right to surgery.

Speaker 1: 29:43

When they may not need it. And I will share for because I've experienced this with clients as well. When they go to an agency, I'm calling them agencies, but that could be a marketing firm, it could be an ad agency. Whatever it is, if they're going there, I assure you, if they make a promise, a bold promise, go somewhere else, because I don't think that a branding you can't control the markets, you can't control customers, you're just going by facts. I'm not a branding expert like yourself, but I know from our clients we've worked alongside with an agency, with them the ones that make the bold promises are the ones that get the worst outcome or the worst product in return. You know it could be everything from. You know we can get you 10,000 more views on YouTube. How can you say, how can you guarantee that? Because you can't, you know not the right views anyways. So I just throw that in because that's what I've seen with some of our business owners we work with.

Speaker 2: 30:45

And I'll share this. You know, it sounds like you know could have a lot of entrepreneurs with you know it sounds like you could have a lot of entrepreneurs with you know great ideas and businesses that they're wanting to stand up. And we did this eight years ago when we launched Rebranding Experts, and we had done a few rebrandings previously with another agency that I own and we did a really good job with them, you know, but I said to myself really good job with them, you know. But I said to myself whoa, let's define the whole methodology that an organization should go through here and have it step-by-step in a very detailed project management plan and make sure that every question that needs to be asked in a rebranding exercise is built into that process so that you don't get through it and find out oops, we should have done this. We should have done that. We overguessed, we overestimated what could happen here and built out that whole methodology. We did research among companies that had rebranded not clients of ours, but companies that we identified and reached out to them and said would you be willing to participate in a research effort To say what were the challenges that you faced, what were the things that you didn't expect that emerged and took all those learnings and built it into our methodology so that when we launched the agency, we could say our approach is based upon what rebranded organizations have gone through. It's not what we're telling you you need to do in this bold new brand. It's really based upon the experience that companies have had and they've told us.

Speaker 2: 32:21

You know, one of the things that was very clear is the internal side of rebranding is much harder than the external side. So coming up with that new experience that you're going to deliver to customers, defining what process procedures are going to need to be updated, how your employees are going to be trained to do that differently, how your leadership is going to be the cheerleaders that they need to be to encourage employees to deliver against that new promise, to inspire them to be a part of all this before you ever launch, is more important than what the externally people are going to be seeing. And that's where you see a lot of organizations that will rebrand and it's kind of like frosting on the cake. It's not all they're doing is making the product look a little bit better and you know, and something that might engage more customers.

Speaker 2: 33:15

But then when you go back and you buy the product. It's the same old company that it used to be. They haven't done anything differently. And that's where you get the disappointment then and the rebranding because like, oh yeah, they just put some lipstick on the pig. They didn't really actually change themselves. They're not delivering on a promise. To me that's different than the past. So if you're starting a new business, if you're early in those first years is make sure that the way you have built your process is different than what anybody else is offering out in the marketplace and you're more likely to get the customer you want then, because they're going to perceive you as being much more knowledgeable, much more trustworthy in the whole process, because it's not just your opinion on what you need to do, but it's a whole, you know, kind of different framework of looking at that problem and solving it.

Speaker 1: 34:10

You mentioned about 18 months for the. I don't know the research which, to me, it was the whole exercise, yeah, and that doesn't sound very long to me, but as a coach I know how long it takes to transform a business. But so branding, if you do it properly, you're looking at it about 18 months. What's the timeframe afterwards? So if it, the rebranding is done, right and well. Six months, nine months, cause you know, we have a new brand here. So just because we have our new brand doesn't mean everybody's going to.

Speaker 2: 34:46

Yeah, they're not going to come running to it. You're. You're going to spend six to, you know, to 12 months after it, making sure people know that you've changed the brand. And you know cause people. You know the essence of communications is is repetition, you know. So you just got to keep repeating it. You know we are now, you know, such and such a company and you know, for 12 months you're going to have on your website. When people go to the website, you're going to make sure that there's a little disclaimer. They're saying you know, formally such and such, so that people say, oh, that's right, it changed that's. You know these are the good people I liked. You know, and and they changed their name. So and you gotta you have to aggressively tell them and show them through your actions. Aggressively tell them and show them through your actions what that new brand stands for and bring it to life. And you know day one, you know.

Speaker 2: 35:34

So a perfect example is you know we worked with a credit union in the Southwest. You know credit unions have always been named after the employer group that they originated against and those are really old and stale sounding now and they feel very exclusive to anybody else wanting to do business with them. So if you're under the name of General Motors Credit Union, well, if you don't work for General Motors, you're not going to go to that credit union. So a lot of credit unions are needing to rebrand themselves right now to be able to be relative to a much larger customer segment. So in this case, we said day one when somebody walks in after you put up a new sign and you've told everybody through your media announcement and your advertising and your billboards going up around town that you are now this new organization. When they walk in the door, something better be different. They better be greeted differently. There needs to be a new experience that they're going to have, the language with which your people are talking to them.

Speaker 2: 36:44

Or they're going to say, well, that's really fancy on the outside, but the inside is still the same and I don't feel any different. What new programs or services? You're going to say, well, that's really fancy on the outside, but the inside is still the same and I don't feel any different. You know what new programs or services you're going to offer. You know, in this particular case they had a reward program that they offered to their longstanding original members to make them feel more special and, you know, on a little bit higher of a pedestal because they were there from the start, and then you could go out and also market to new customers and you had to make sure that it was positioned as to why are we no longer what we used to be? Why are we better for you as an option here? So it's a very complex effort, you know, and it requires a lot of leadership across the organization being included in changing, transforming the organization to meet the new brand.

Speaker 1: 37:34

Yeah, that's one of the areas. This is a subjective opinion, but it's one of those areas. I would not go with my gut on every brand. I would go with the market research because you can really do a lot of damage if you go at it alone and don't know what you're doing and go with your gut versus market research and doing this comprehensive stuff that you're talking about. Is there anything that I haven't asked that you're like? I know from time to time when I'm on a podcast I'm like I wish I'd really like to talk about this because this part is so important. Is there anything like that I haven't covered here?

Speaker 2: 38:09

You know. One thing I think would be important is to realize if you're a smaller business, this is actually an easier process. You know, rebranding an airline is a monumental offer, you know, because you've got to paint planes with your new logo and you have to change gate signage and all sorts of different stuff. If you're a smaller business, it's going to be easier for you to go through this process because you know who your customer base is. You can communicate directly to them. You know the prospects that you're going after. You can easily communicate to them. You're going to have less what we call branded assets, like signage and materials and so forth, that you have to spend money updating so you're able to be a little bit more nimble in making the change. And that's why I always encourage entrepreneurs if you're starting a business for the first time, spend time getting the brand right from the beginning so that you don't find yourself needing to rebrand very soon down the road. And if you are a smaller business and you've been in business for a while and you realize you know I didn't spend as much time working on the brand from the beginning as I did setting up the operations and so forth you're still in a good place to take advantage of a brand refresh, a repositioning or an entire rebrand, because it's a less complicated kind of environment with which to execute that Entrepreneurs always fall into a few buckets.

Speaker 2: 39:41

They name the business after themselves and then they're having good success and they're like starting to think of an exit strategy and they realize their brand is tethered to them and all of a sudden you're like, okay, this is gonna be a heavier lift than I thought, because if I'm gonna sell my business someday and I'm not gonna be a part of it, this name isn't gonna work anymore.

Speaker 2: 40:01

So solve that for a potential buyer in the future, so that it doesn't become their problem to deal with. So we're seeing a lot of like dental practices right now. That used to be you know, dr Bruce Ogison was the dentist as a child I used to go to and now they're more corporate businesses that own several practices and they're branding themselves like magnificent smiles or bright smiles or things like that. They're focusing on the outcome of what you will get from an experience with them having a terrific set of choppers and a great smile, as opposed to the person who doesn't, and so that's a good example in a smaller business environment, professional services, how you know, get ahead and brand on the outcome of doing work with you, as opposed to you, the person that's doing the work.

Speaker 1: 40:51

Not to jump on top of that, but I do have an area of business. If you're considering a business and for some reason the company name takes them forever because they're trying to be too creative, if you mow lawns, start with residential lawn mowing Like people will at least know what you do. You know, versus green skies, plateaus or something you know I don't. I see that all the time. And then they wonder why no one calls them. It's like cause they don't know what you do and most people won't ask.

Speaker 2: 41:26

So uh, and we get a lot of businesses where, you know, in that exact kind of thing I started out this is a very common one in some kind of home repair. So maybe they did plumbing and then they added electrical and then they added, you know, HVAC and so forth, but they still their brand is still associated with plumbing. Yeah, and they're like how do we get out of this now? Because they're not giving us the chance, because they perceive us as the, you know, as just doing plumbing and that's a rebrand. Then, where you need to, your services have broadened, your brand needs to broaden out and you need to go through the study of what's the best way to do that.

Speaker 1: 42:05

That's a great example. Thanks for sharing A lot of those. I know a lot of listeners are probably just like how do I learn more? What's the best way to find you on the internet, social media, all those channels?

Speaker 2: 42:17

So rebranding expertscom and we have have it loaded with a lot of resources, um, uh, stories that I write for Forbes. You can find on there videos, that kind of dive into the process and so forth, and then follow me on LinkedIn, jim Heininger. You can follow the business on LinkedIn. Rebranding Experts probably the most active social channel we're on, but certainly there for Facebook Instagram as well too.

Speaker 1: 42:45

Okay, great, fantastic. Well, I always end with a general question. If you were in front of an audience of small business owners different sizes, different industries what's one thing that's applicable to all of them? It could be an insight, a quote, a book, anything that kind of helps them have a voice of hope.

Speaker 2: 43:04

Well, and I, you know I'm always going to bring it back to you know is keep attention on your brand. You know I'm always going to bring it back to. You know, is keep, keep attention on your brand. You know, and, and, and. Don't be afraid, if your brand isn't right to, to make changes to it. You know, it seems like such a sacrificial cow to some people it's. You know I can't touch that, I can't do that. Sure you can, yeah, you know you. So be the business problem solver that you're, you're, you're you set yourself up to be, and make sure that that's something you keep an eye on and that it's working as absolutely hard as it can for your business.

Speaker 1: 43:41

Are you open to questions? If anybody has any, absolutely yeah.

Speaker 2: 43:45

Shout to you. Yeah, and you can email me at jim at rebrandingexpertscom. Happy to respond.

Speaker 1: 43:51

Fantastic. Well, I encourage our listeners to do just that, because branding either creates business or loses business, in my opinion. So, jim, I appreciate it. You've been a wealth of information and a blessing to many. Thank you for listening to Small Business Pivots. This podcast is created and produced by my company, boss. Our business is growing yours. Boss offers flexible business loans with business coaching support. Apply in minutes and get approved and funded in as little as 24 to 48 hours at businessownershipsimplifiedcom. If you're enjoying this podcast, don't forget to hit the subscribe button and share it as well. If you need help growing your business, email me at michael at michaeldmorrisoncom. We'll see you next time on Small Business Pivots.