Mastering Sales Funnels: The Key to Driving Business Growth | Karen Grill

Ever wondered how to truly master the customer journey within your business? Join us for an enlightening conversation with Karen Grill, a seasoned business coach and strategist with over 15 years of experience. Karen helps us uncover the essentials of sales funnels, dispelling common myths and illustrating their crucial role in guiding customers from first contact to final sale. You'll learn how to map out the customer path effectively by starting with the end goal in mind and working backwards, whether through simple call scheduling links or more complex systems designed to move potential clients into controlled environments like email lists.

For all the entrepreneurs out, this episode is a must-listen. We dive into practical strategies for creating and optimizing sales funnels that save time and boost efficiency for your small business. Discover how to navigate new email authentication rules from Google, Yahoo, and Microsoft to ensure your emails reach their intended audience. Karen shares insights into the high ROI of email marketing and the importance of building an email list organically before considering paid ads. She highlights the significant impact professional assistance can have on setting up successful email funnels.

Finally, we explore innovative marketing strategies using tools like chat GPT. Learn why providing the right context to chat GPT is critical for generating valuable content and how to use it for brainstorming and editing rather than primary content creation. Karen emphasizes creating compelling messages that speak directly to your audience's needs and pain points, rather than focusing solely on keyword optimization. This episode is packed with actionable insights and strategies to help small business owners master the art of sales funnels and enhance their marketing efforts.

Karen Grill: Business Coach & Funnel Optimizer

Website: https://karengrill.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karengrill1/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/karenagrill

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/karenagrill/

Free Email Opt-In Audit: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1moDzYRlGxZjKkwY10hU0IK2zcqu7P6jS_Nvl9u5cr5Q/edit

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Chapters

• 0:00 Understanding Funnels in Business
• 7:03 Navigating Sales Funnels in Business
• 12:08 Email Authentication and Funnels
• 17:07 Effective Marketing Strategies for Small Businesses

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

All right, welcome to another Small Business Pivots. Today we have a special guest from around the world, and I know no one can introduce your name and your company like you can, so I'll let you have the floor to do that.

Speaker 2: 0:12

Thanks so much. I'm Karen. I am a business coach and strategist, and I started my first online business about 15 years ago, and so I know a lot of the struggles that small business owners have, and I really love helping small business owners. You know, learn how to create offers, learn how to build funnels so they can work less and earn more, and really help build a business that fits their life.

Speaker 1: 0:34

What part of this world are you coming to us from?

Speaker 2: 0:37

I am in the Washington DC area on the East coast.

Speaker 1: 0:40

Wow, there's nothing happening up there right now. No, nothing. I'm really quiet. I bet it's real quiet Anything. If someone has not been to that area that you would suggest them at least doing once.

Speaker 2: 0:54

Sure. So two of my favorite places in Washington DC are the archives, so you can see the Declaration of Independence, all the great things, and also the Library of Congress is beautiful and they have some really great exhibits. So those are two places I would go to.

Speaker 1: 1:07

Very cool. So what are we going to help our listeners with today?

Speaker 2: 1:11

So I want to help them understand what funnels are. I think funnels kind of have a bad name kind of with the bro marketing and Lamborghinis and gold chains and things. So I want to kind of dispel that and help people understand what funnels are and it's really just your customer's journey in your business.

Speaker 1: 1:28

That's as simple as that. Fantastic, because I know a lot of business owners want to grow their business and this is essential to doing that. So let's introduce our show real quick and we'll be right back. Welcome to Small Business Pivots, a podcast designed for small business owners. Business Pivots a podcast designed for small business owners. I'm your host, michael Morrison, a small business coach and founder of BOSS, where we make business ownership simplified for success, so that you can own a business that runs without you. To learn more, go to businessownershipsimplifiedcom. All right, welcome back, karen. We have a lot to talk about on funnels because, like you said, there's myths about them. There's so much information about them and I know for a lot of business owners they've been burned from them before They've paid somebody to do this. So I'll just let you have the floor on kind of what are the foundations that people should know about funnels, what to look for, what they're for and how they can, what they can expect from them.

Speaker 2: 2:26

So, like I said, funnels really are the customer's journey. So I think it really starts with mapping out like where do you want your clients to go? And a lot of times that's maybe your main offer. You might have some smaller things along the way, so maybe that's where you start just thinking about where you want your clients to end up, or potential clients, and start there. And then that's when you start kind of building backwards in those funnels and a lot of people tell me they oh, Karen, I don't have a funnel. But when I look they really do.

Speaker 2: 2:49

Almost everybody has a funnel of some kind. So it could be like, let's say, we're on LinkedIn and that's kind of where we met. If you then have a link that takes people off to schedule a call with you, that's kind of a mini funnel right there. So it's really, you know, a part of that customer journey. So people have funnels and not even know it. So it's really then okay, now that we have, even if it's that simple one, well, how do we optimize that? And you'll see that a lot of times people will have people schedule the call, but it's not clear when they're supposed to, what the call is about, how long it's going to be point with your customer along that journey. So, whether it's the super small funnel or a super long, complicated funnel, we're trying to look at making it the easiest way for the customer to go from one point to another.

Speaker 1: 3:34

Would this be similar to a pipeline? Is it the same thing or is this completely different?

Speaker 2: 3:39

Yeah, I mean, I think it's the same thing. I mean we can do ones for sales, and usually people talk about pipeline in terms of sales, but it could also be like to sign up for a lead magnet. Even so, it's not necessarily you're getting money at the end of it, but you're starting to get them on your list. So one of the big things with social media is we don't own those platforms, and I don't know if you've ever been kind of restricted on one of the platforms. I've been restricted on LinkedIn before, and so it's scary, we all have.

Speaker 2: 4:01

Yes, we all have in some way right, and it's kind of scary if you've built a lot of your business or a lot of your contacts are on there, and so I think one of the best funnels to have is some way to get them off those social media platforms where you gather them as the audience and get them into something that you can control, and obviously email is one of those places.

Speaker 1: 4:18

So where would one start?

Speaker 2: 4:44

So maybe a business owner is new to being a business owner. Lot of times people are willing to maybe make a small investment. They're not ready for that $10,000 coaching package right from the beginning, right, and so starting with something that they can start to know you and see if you connect, because you know, not everyone's for me, not everyone's for you and so it's really finding those right people, and so if they get a little taste of how you are whether it could be posting on LinkedIn, it could be having a lead magnet, doing something that they get to learn a little bit about you so that they can start to take the next steps. I talk a lot about micro commitments and what that means is getting those potential clients to give you little yeses, and it could even just having them comment on one of your posts on social media, or maybe it is signing, giving that email and signing up for some kind of lead magnet.

Speaker 1: 5:30

So or maybe it is signing, giving that email and signing up for some kind of lead magnet. So those are little micro yeses that lead to those bigger yeses. I have a lot of business owners ask me what a lead magnet?

Speaker 2: 5:34

is. Could you explain what that does and its purpose? Sure, so a lead magnet is basically something that you're giving someone in exchange for their email address. So it could be a checklist, it could be a PDF, it could be some kind of calculator. I mean, it could be anything that maybe you already have in your business. I mean, a lot of people create tools for their clients, so maybe it's a scaled down version of one of those tools that you're just offering for free again, so people get a chance to see how you work. You know the types of things that you offer. So it's very simple, like I said, a PDF it could. It could be an ebook, it could be some kind of calculator. Whatever that is for your in your business, something that you use. I would just repurpose it for that.

Speaker 1: 6:09

So when they work with someone like yourself, what does that typically look like?

Speaker 2: 6:15

So I mean, typically I work with somebody who has a funnel and it's not really working that well, and so it's kind of up to me to kind of audit it and see what are the places that people are dropping off. And there's usually some drop-off points all along the way, but there's usually some big ones, and so I'm really looking for those places that we can kind of fill those gaps so people can continue down all the way to the end of the funnel.

Speaker 1: 6:36

So you've built your business. You said you've been in business for 15 years. Congratulations, that's a patent administrator.

Speaker 2: 6:44

So I did a lot of docketing and I did some letters and things for them. And at that time I had two little kids and I was really struggling a little bit with productivity and kind of how to structure my business, having to take care of them and do all this work. And I found that a lot of the people that were teaching productivity and kind of business at the time most were men and they didn't really understand what my life was like as a mom who had kids. And, you know, something would happen at school they'd get hit in the head in gym class and I'd have to take them to urgent care, you know. And I would ask them so what do I do? When I had this perfect plan for my day and things like this happened and they just didn't know what to do because they're like I just go to work for eight hours and that's it.

Speaker 2: 7:38

And so I really found that I needed to kind of find my own way as a mom and business owner, and that's when I get down the coaching path, and so I kind of switched from doing that type of work and then to becoming a coach. And now, you know, I found a lot of my clients were having issues with sales and creating those funnels. So they've been in business a while, they've had some clients and then they start to get more and they don't have any of the system and things in place and also to kind of have those continuous leads. So that's when I kind of have shifted a little bit and I still have the business coaching, but I do kind of focus more on the funnels.

Speaker 1: 8:11

On these funnels. The most often asked question is what can I expect they do the same thing in digital marketing, seo? What kind of return on my investment can I see as far as what I was doing versus what I could be doing with someone like you?

Speaker 2: 8:29

So a lot of times what I find is, you know, people kind of cobbled together things in the beginning, right, and so it's not really streamlined in any ways, and there's a lot of people who don't even have automations in place, so they're doing a lot of the manual work. So it's really kind of looking at that whole thing as a holistic piece and figuring out, okay, what are the pieces we can automate, what are some things maybe we can optimize. So it's really looking at it. So it actually takes less time for you, which I think most people want, and often you'll get more leads and potentially then more money. So in terms of a straight arrow, I can't say each situation is different, but definitely people often just say to me it's such a relief, now I know this funnel is working, I don't have to do anything, it's just working behind the scenes, and so I think you know getting back some of that time is really important as well.

Speaker 1: 9:11

Other than pinpointing where people are dropping off, what is the most important part of the funnel as far as turning them into a lead?

Speaker 2: 9:19

So I think a lot of people you know put up lead magnets and other things without really thinking of that strategy, of where they want to take them to, and so you might have one on one topic and something on another topic, and so people don't have a reason to continue down because they think, oh, I got this piece and your next offer is completely different topic, that's not related to me, right? So you really have to think of again that end goal and then work backwards and know what are the pieces that I can do. That's maybe like the first one is maybe 20% of the whole journey and then 40% kind of of the journey, right, really thinking about what's the first step and first win that I can get for them. What's the next one that leads them then down to the full offer that gets them the whole piece?

Speaker 1: 9:58

Is a funnel reliant on an email list.

Speaker 2: 10:07

I think it's a big part of that right. Some people can do it like through messenger and kind of other kind of messaging apps and things, but I do think email is a big part. A lot of people are moving to texting, which is another way to do it as well, but I think email has been around a long time. It really brings one of the biggest ROIs for your business because you have this list that you have control over, that you know you can help give them value but then also make offers to on your timeline right. And it's not like social media because you know they may just be scrolling and not see that you have more likelihood that they'd be opening it in their inbox, and so I think email can be a really good cornerstone for a funnel.

Speaker 1: 10:40

That was kind of my segue into emails, because this is Q3 2024 that we're recording Unbelievable hard to believe this is second half of the year, but it is and Google just came out with a lot of stuff and you've kind of been coaching people through that on LinkedIn, so can you share a little bit about what that is, how it works and why we need to be aware of it?

Speaker 2: 11:02

Right. So Google, yahoo and it's been Microsoft and kind of all of them have come together to create these new authentication rules for emails.

Speaker 1: 11:10

You're listening to Small Business Pivots. This episode is proudly brought to you by Boss, where business ownership is simplified for success. At BOSS, we help business owners create their businesses to run smoothly without them being there 24-7. Our seasoned business coaches who have walked the path themselves provide invaluable guidance and support and with additional services like fast business loans, some approved within 24 to 48 hours, comprehensive online courses, detailed workbooks and engaging classes, boss offers a wealth of resources to help you succeed. Discover how small business success begins with Boss at businessownershipsimplifiedcom. If you're enjoying the podcast, make sure to stay connected by hitting that subscribe button, giving us a thumbs up or leaving a positive review.

Speaker 2: 12:07

Your support keeps us going. Now let's get back to our incredible guest, right? So Google, yahoo and it's been Microsoft and kind of all of them have come together to create these new authentication rules for emails. So in the past, you could send out emails through an email service provider like MailChimp or ConvertKit, using like a Gmail address so karengrill at gmailcom. That's no longer the case. You actually have to have a domain-based email, so it'd be info at karengrillcom, right? So have my domain be part of that email address. In addition, they've required people to have certain records and terms, so it's somewhat complicated.

Speaker 2: 12:41

But in terms of being able to send, you have to have things authenticated the proper way, otherwise your emails will not get through and Google and Yahoo are starting to penalize. They started in June and April and if your emails aren't getting through, there's no reason to sit down and take your time, waste your time writing these emails if they're not getting through to the end user. So it's really important. If you haven't learned anything about that, you know there's a lot of information out there, but you really need to take this seriously. I think a lot of business owners were caught off guard. They didn't think it was going to happen, or they didn't really know the implications. And knowing now that these huge email lists, their emails aren't getting through and they're getting penalized, that's a big issue for so many business owners.

Speaker 1: 13:23

Yeah, it is. So what is kind of that number? Is it for someone that's only sending out like hundreds of emails, or is this like every email?

Speaker 2: 13:31

So you know, originally they had talked about people sending over 5,000 emails, but they've actually backtracked on that and they said, basically, this is going to be the new standard for email marketing. So, even if they aren't penalizing everyone right now, at some point they will. They want this to be the standard process from now on, and so I think it's important that all the business owners take that seriously. If you make money with your email list, this is serious, and I think you really need to make sure that you're authenticated properly.

Speaker 1: 13:57

Are people that use. I'm not promoting this platform, but for people that use, like MailChimp or something like that, do we have to be aware or be concerned with that also, I guess?

Speaker 2: 14:07

So it's really only when you use kind of those email service providers MailChimp, convertkit, whatever that is they had tried to help people, you know, go through the steps that needed to happen, and so I would definitely check with whatever mail service provider you're using, but a lot of them fell short in what actually Google and Yahoo wanted. So it's really important that you kind of educate yourself as business owners. Unfortunately, it's an ongoing process. We're always having to learn new skills, new things, and so I definitely think first go to your email service provider and see what they're saying. But there are places that you can check to make sure that you're authenticated properly, so I definitely recommend that. I reviewed gosh now. It's like over 85 different businesses and their authentications and I would say like 80% are not correct, and so it's definitely important, even if you think you've done it right, most of the time it's not done completely. So I definitely recommend you know educating yourself about that.

Speaker 1: 15:03

Do you offer that service?

Speaker 2: 15:04

I do. I do a lot of that authentication process now and really just checking if you have it right, I mean you can go off and I'll just let you know that. But if you have troubles I will definitely help you with that.

Speaker 1: 15:15

So can you help us answer this question? We have business owners that I know. I need to build an email list, but I can't get anybody to my website to get them to even download a lead. Jen, Do you have any suggestions for that?

Speaker 2: 15:29

Yeah, I mean it depends a little bit on how your business is built. I mean, a lot of people now use social media to drive them to sign up to things. So if you have any social media platforms that you're using, that's an easy way and that's one of the easiest way. I think people do that. You know people do run ads. I mean that is an option A lot of the businesses.

Speaker 2: 15:46

I recommend starting organic because you don't want to spend money on something you haven't tested, and organic is at least one way to test, to see if this message is resonating, if people actually want what I'm offering, because if not, I don't want you to spend money on that. So there's, you know different ways you can try that. But definitely having a traffic strategy is just as important as any other kind of strategy that you have, right. So really figuring out okay, how do I get people to know about me? Right, and and that's kind of one of the main issues for any business, let alone for a funnel so figuring out, how am I going to send people from, maybe, social media to sign up on that signup page and then get them on my email list so I can start to get them there?

Speaker 1: 16:23

So the big question is people try to do it yourself. The funnels they watch, the YouTubes, the books, and I know this can be all over the board but what percentage would you guess would be the difference between results of the do-it-yourselfers versus having someone like you that does it every day, the difference in outcomes?

Speaker 2: 16:45

So I definitely know that a lot of my clients after they've worked with me a lot of times. It can be 30% to 50% increase. So it can be a big difference. But I still think that people should start where they are right. So if you don't have the money or you don't have the budget or this isn't on your timeline right now, that shouldn't prevent you from starting. So I definitely think you should start kind of building that funnel. Like I said, a simple funnel it could be to schedule for start there yourself so you can start to see. You know we're business owners. We have to be responsible for our data. Anyone to sign up, you know you have an issue before you even need to talk to me. You can identify that yourself right. So start with a small funnel, start testing it up, get more complicated ones or you want to optimize what you have. That's when I would reach out to somebody else.

Speaker 1: 17:29

So we work. We're a business coach company. Also, we work with a lot of business owners, and there's this thing that you may have heard about chat GPT.

Speaker 2: 17:42

Yes.

Speaker 1: 17:43

Is that the end, all solution to? I just throw my. I need content for this, copy, paste it and go. Can you address a little bit about that, because I know that's part of the funnel, because content is part of the funnels. Can you help us out on that?

Speaker 2: 17:57

Yes. So I mean, I definitely think you know chat GPT is a tool that we can use, but I don't think people are using it the right way. They just kind of ask them a question and think it'll, you know, create this compelling content. But unless you give it the right context right, it doesn't know your audience, it doesn't know their pain points, it doesn't know really what you offer. So if you're not providing it a lot of time and information and letting it know what you're looking for, it's not going to give you good results. So I definitely recommend you know.

Speaker 2: 18:25

If you're using it for brainstorming ideas, I think that can work, but I wouldn't use it to write your content or to write your sales page or to write your offer. Instead, I would have you, since you're the expert in what you do. You have been working with your audience. You know their pain points and their troubles that they have. I would start with you creating the sales page or whatever. That is, the email, the content, and then you can ask chat GPT, you know, is it? How does this look? Is there any changes you would make? Does this seem in alignment Right? So I would use it almost as like a check to make sure that you kind of are on the right thing. I wouldn't use it to actually create the content. I would use it for brainstorming. I would use it maybe for editing or checking if you're on the right track, but that's how I would recommend using it.

Speaker 1: 19:04

What goes into the content formula, because I know there's some SEO keywords, things like that. How much is that part of the funnel being important?

Speaker 2: 19:17

So you know it's obviously I think the most important thing is really having kind of a message or compelling offer for your target audience. And so I find some people get too distracted with all the keywords and so it doesn't seem like it kind of flows in terms of what they're talking about. It doesn't seem like a real person is actually writing it because they're trying to get the right keywords in the right place. So I would rather have you start and really create the content that you know that your audience needs to hear and that they would want, and then you can think about okay, well, maybe we need to just optimize it and look for those keywords, make sure they're in the right place. We have it in the header, you know second header and all those things.

Speaker 2: 19:53

But I think first it's about creating the content. Then you can kind of go back and change it, because otherwise I find that the content is stilted. I find that the content is stilted. It's not normal. People would not read this, it's not interesting, it doesn't have a hook. You know the hook is one of the most important things for social media posts and even in emails, kind of the subject line. So if you're not optimizing for that, you know, you can have all the keywords you want and it's not really going to help you because it's not going to be, it's not going to resonate with your ideal audience. So, again, I think it's all about us, you know, standing in our place of being an expert and then taking that information and making sure that it's the right message that our audience needs to hear.

Speaker 1: 20:27

Do you offer content writing?

Speaker 2: 20:29

I do. So you know. You know that I've done a persuasion strategist course and so I do a lot with persuasion, and so that's definitely something I help clients with as well.

Speaker 1: 20:37

So let's go to the business. Put our business owner hat on. What would you say are some things you've learned along the way that you would share with others that may not know that.

Speaker 2: 20:49

So you know, I think, especially when I was starting out, I was definitely a little naive about, you know, kind of creating offer. I definitely was more kind of factual based. I just said what my offer was and I thought that that would be enough. But especially now, with the way you know, having internet and everyone has access to so information, and probably over information overloaded with information we need to figure out ways to stand out.

Speaker 2: 21:11

And just saying that I have I offer business coaching and I have this many sessions, I mean that just doesn't do it right. You really have to speak to how you're going to help the clients, like the transformation that you're going to do for them, and figure out a way that's really going to tap into what they're looking for, their problems and their issues. And so I think, you know, at the beginning I was too kind of practical about the way I did my offers and I really learned along the way. If I want to get those results, if I want my funnel to work, if I want my offer to work, my sales page, I have to make sure that I'm really putting everything in terms of my ideal client. It's not about me, it's not about what I offer, but what they need and what they want.

Speaker 1: 21:47

What are some tips on marketing in general? I know that marketing has to work together. So we have our social media, we have our webpage. So what are some guidance tips that you can give to hey, when you're doing this, make sure everything does this, or something to how it all ties together.

Speaker 2: 22:05

So I think one of the things that I find with a lot of business owners is they're not clear themselves, right, and so if we don't have the clarity, we aren't going to be able to have a message that actually resonates. And so once we're clear on what we're doing, what we're offering, who we're offering it to, all those things then I think it's easier to be in alignment across all our marketing efforts. So, whether it's social media and email, our website, all those things. So start with the clarity for you and your business and your audience, and then I think it's easier to create those messages that will resonate across the board.

Speaker 1: 22:35

We work with small business owners, but we don't work with every small business owner because they're in different seasons of business. They might have different pain points. So what you said about clarity is so important about know who your ideal client is first, so you know what to you, how you can even help them. That's a great, great point that you mentioned. If someone wants to learn more about you, get in touch with you. What are the best ways to do that?

Speaker 2: 23:02

Well, I am definitely LinkedIn. That's usually where I hang out, so you can find me there at Karen Grell. If you are interested in having a call, I have callwithkarencom and you can reach me there.

Speaker 1: 23:12

Fantastic. Let's say there's a room full of business owners of all different sizes and industries. What is one applicable advice you could say that would work for all of them?

Speaker 2: 23:24

Start with the simplest funnel. Make sure you're looking at it's working all the way. Figure out ways you can optimize it before you go off and try to spend money and hire someone else. Really work with what you have first. Try to do the best you can and then seek advice from other people.

Speaker 1: 23:37

That's so important. And for business owners out there that are looking for someone, first of all, make sure they call you Karen, but if, for some reason, you're daring enough to go, try to find somebody else. What are some tips that they should look for? Because we have all these fibers and we have uproar, we have all these places and I, like many business owners, have been severely burned by a lot of people on there. So how can someone find? Well, I mean, what are some tips or guidance you can say, like make sure they do this or don't do that, or whatever.

Speaker 2: 24:13

So I definitely find that when I've made kind of hiring mistakes is I wasn't prepared enough for myself, so I actually didn't wasn't clear enough on what I wanted from them. I also didn't have any of the systems set up ahead of time so that when they came in they were set up for success. So I actually found that it was mostly a lot of the time my fault, that I wasn't prepared enough and so I was not setting them up for success. So I think it starts with us making sure you're really clear on what you're going to have them do. Do you have those systems in place so when they come in they have all the information they need to get started? Because a lot of times we don't and so they can't really get started and so you're kind of paying them and they're not really doing the work that you want yet. So making sure you have those systems in place.

Speaker 2: 24:51

But I also think it's important to take the time. I think a lot of people try to hire really quickly because they need someone right away. But you also need to make sure there's some kind of rapport with the person, that you have some idea that they can do what you want them to do. There's definitely things you can teach people, but they need to at least have the right kind of mindset for your work. So I think it starts with us first, but then making sure you're really taking the time to hire the right people.

Speaker 1: 25:14

I want to expand on that, because I tell business owners all the time because we always find an excuse right, well, I can't find good people. It's because of this, it's the economy, it's Congress. No, this mess that you have, mr or Ms Business Owner, you either created that or allowed it to happen. So take ownership first. I love what you just said, so I just wanted to kind of give my rant.

Speaker 1: 25:42

Well, Karen, you've been a blessing to everyone that's listening. I appreciate you. We'll see you on LinkedIn and everybody. Make sure you go, follow Karen and reach out to her. You see how friendly and smiley she is. I promise you you'll have a good conversation. Thanks again, Karen.

Speaker 2: 25:57

Oh, thanks so much, Michael. It's good to talk to you.

Speaker 1: 25:59

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